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I wish to thank Jim Gerfin, Charlie and David McGown to turning me on to this. While they are using better quality equipment than I am, David suggested trying the simple $25 TP Link converters along with a 2 meter optical cable, then a 1' CAT8 cable on either end to replace the CAT 8 cable between my ethernet switch and end point/renderer. There is a marked and obvious improvement in sound quality.

This is an easy to try change, it may work for others by creating galvanic isolation between the switch and renderer. Total cost was about $70-$75.

Next upgrades will be linear supplies for the switch, router and converters. Later, I'll spring for better quality ethernet components with better clocks.

A great explanation of what is happening is found in the attached paper. Lots of room for improvement here.

Thanks again!

Stuart

I also owe a debt to David, Roscoe, Charlie, Grover, others (and you too Stu) for for nudging me in the right direction many times. Hearing David's latest system with his new amps was an eye-opener.

While much of the sound that I heard was due to the new 211 amps and their match with David's Elsinor speakers, it is also apparent that his digital set up is very, very good. My Holo May is about the best measuring NOS DAC on the market with a bombproof USB receiver implementation and widely thought of as pretty decent sounding. Running either Roon Nucleus+ directly into the May via USB or using a pi4 for with LPS as a Roon endpoint provided ok results. However, I had a nagging feeling that I was not hearing the May at its best. Comments from Charlie about his digital set-up sounding on par with his analog set-up always made me wonder since in my setup, analog is clearly superior (at least with 50s 60s jazz LPs). But David's new amps demonstrate what a digital set up at this level can do. Not an analog sound per say, but an alternative sound that may well approach analog in terms of overall enjoyment.

I got an Aurilac Aries G1.1 to use as a Roon endpoint. Holy smokes, improvement was not subtle. I hear a substantial increase in detail and information while at the same time, a smoother, richer, fuller sound. Timing and pacing is much improved, more analog sounding. The trailing note decay and the 3D sense of palpability went way up. I may only be getting a portion of what Davids or Charlie's digital system is providing but it is a significant step over what I had been using it.

Up to now I have been using supra cat8 cables from FiOS to router to Roon Core and/or endpoint. As you know, there could be issues using shielded cat8 cables with non-grounded routers and switches. Although I don't have any audible noise issues, I removed the ground connection on the receiving end of the super cable, but (not 100% sure if the ethernet ports are actually grounded themselves?). But this can also pose issues with the shield itself inducing EMI into the twisted pairs and/or transmitting component noise along the shield. I tried swapping out some of the supra cat8 cables with certified/tested, non-shielded blue jean cat6a cable. The difference was subtle, perhaps a bit more laid-back sound overall with the cat6a cable? May or may not work to your advantage in your system for the remaining ethernet cables but I gather the use of optical conversion makes this conversation largely redundant. I'll have try out this optical conversion set up next....

Another way to do it is to have the DACs in the same chassis as the DSP processing. I am now using the Danville Signal dspNexus 2/8 that Rich has been talking about. Everything is in one chassis so there are no concerns with interconnecting cables between the processing and the eight AKM DACs. Rich set up the original parameters based on what was in my DEQX processor but I spent about two weeks tweaking it including making new measurements of time alignment of the drivers at the listening position. The sound now is great. Since I am an early adopter and have been providing a lot of feedback, there is a new processor board that has 4 times the processing power coming out. I will be getting one as part of the EA program. I'm including some in room measurements at the listening position as well as info on the unit. The new processor will allow even more control of the low end. Remember, these measurements are not quasi anechoic but include what actually arrives at the listening position including room effects. Measurements were done with Room EQ Wizard with my ACO Pacific 7012 measurement mic.

Oh well, disregard what I said above. Ran 20' of BJ Cat6a (replacing Supra Cat8) which should be better in my setup....but its not. Could not hear much if any difference with the 2' runs between Fios and router or 2' run between router and Roon core but the 20' run between router and endpoint was revealing. Gonna try Cat6 but for now its back to Supra Cat8.

Pete, please try the optical link I mentioned. It is so inexpensive. Replace your long run of CAT-x wirh two very short pieces (I used 1' CAT-8) the two TPLink wthernet fiber converters and a run (2 meters in my case) of SC-SC optical fiber.

I have no doubt but that you will be amazed!


https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-Ethernet ... 942&sr=8-2


https://www.cables.com/625u125-scsc-855.html

Stuart

Will do. I just need to read up on the options (multi vs single mode, duplex optical etc etc) since I don't know anything about optical conversion/transmission. Any thoughts on running a short run of ethernet fiber in basement and then longer run of ethernet electrical up to my end point vs converting in basement , running long run of optical fiber up to my system room and then converting back to ethernet elec in my system room? Would like to keep a bunch of black boxes, PS, cabling in the basement and out of my system room if possible?

Pete,

I believe the maximum benefit to optical fiber is a galvanic break at the endpoint (i.e. the device with USB out to the DAC). And the ethernet cable between the optical converter and the endpoint should be as short as possible (shorter antenna). The more ethernet cabling and devices you have plugged into a local ethernet switch downstream of the optical converter, the more opportunities for noise to creep back in.

David

Most audiophile switches have galvanic isolation.

Pete,

What I did was follow the advice of Jim/Charlie/David, but on a trial basis. The links I sent to you get you exactly what I'm using. There are separate transmit and receive optical cables. I guess that's duplex mode? Put one converter as close as possible to your endpoint/renderer. The other should connect your renderer to the ethernet switch. Your ethernet switch should have nothing connected to it except for your audio components: NAS, renderer, etc. That ethernet switch should connect to another switch or router where the other household internet connections are made.

Upgrades from this point are linear power supplies for the switches and converters, higher quality converters and switches with better clocks, etc. As is the usual case with audiophile equipment, the sky is the limit price wise. David's gear is very affordable in the audiophile world, and I'm considering exactly what he has: Teradaks converters and an English Electric switch. David can expound on the various options.

But as I initially explained, the cheapest crap-ass consumer grade junk made a wonderful improvement in my rig.

You are welcome to come by and have a listen.

Stuart